Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

If you have a specific question you want me to get back to, put it here and I'll think about it

Moderators: marowak, Blonde, skhmmxi

valkyriemp
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2014 11:28 pm

Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by valkyriemp » Thu Oct 02, 2014 12:12 am

Hi Frank (and all the rest). Been a long time lover of your music and in the wake of the Scottish independence referendum, I find you're my constant playlist.

I'm not sure what you guys hear about this matter, or indeed how many of your membership are fellow Scots, on the Yes or No side of the campaign...it matters not...I came here to say that I have a view about what happened 2 weeks ago. It's not about sore losers and it's not about failing to hear the voice of Scotland. It's about a genuine concern that the voice of Scotland was gagged in the only way Westminster have power.

There's a general election planned for next year. Before you cast your vote, or indeed decide if you have a voice at all, watch this http://educateinspirechange.org/alterna ... ce-stolen/

I'd be really interested to hear the views of people outside of my narrow little world. Up here, North of the border, we have woken up. Right now, our country is more politically aware than it has ever been. And extending voting rights to 16 and 17 year olds is something I wholeheartedly agree with. Challenging corruption is something else I wholeheartedly agree with. We're trying to address these matters in Scotland, and I'd suggest you might all want to have a look at the video. This is not Yes misery speaking, this is injustice.

To Frank - I'd dearly love to talk to you about how you can help to inspire activism in communities...it's our way around a bent out of shape political system, and we're putting an infrastructure around that. You're in a fabulous position with an audience perhaps already one step ahead of the mainstream...

To the rest of you - Anyone reading this who's interested should get in touch for a blether, or to share ideas. Or, if you want to know more, type any derivitive of We are the 45% into facebook and see what you find.

Anyway, if you have any kind of views about this, I'd love to hear them...from all sides...genuinely

valkyriemp
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2014 11:28 pm

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by valkyriemp » Thu Oct 02, 2014 12:15 am

should have added that my current pick me up resides in the closing line...

...memories of hope and of glorious defeat are a little bit harder to beat...

We may have lost the vote, but we have all gained immeasurably

Pete
Posts: 6621
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:10 am

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by Pete » Thu Oct 02, 2014 6:26 am

I'd imagine frank wouldn't want to touch this sort of question with a shitty bargepole. Either upset a majority or a very vocal minority on an issue that, from my conversations, most english people didn't really have much of an opinion - do what you like, it's your country, all I'd personally ask is you keep your own snake oil salesman Salmond up there, along with Brown and Darling if possible.

Also worth having a read of frank's recent interviews and his disinterest in getting wrangled in politics / being labelled political / protest orientated. He's been tarred a few times and I'm guessing but I doubt he will want to again.
frank wrote:Think of it like weight-lifting. High notes are heavy weights.

valkyriemp
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2014 11:28 pm

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by valkyriemp » Wed Oct 08, 2014 11:24 pm

Appreciate your response Pete.. Had to ask - thank you for responding.
Pete wrote:I'd imagine frank wouldn't want to touch this sort of question with a shitty bargepole. Either upset a majority or a very vocal minority on an issue that, from my conversations, most english people didn't really have much of an opinion - do what you like, it's your country, all I'd personally ask is you keep your own snake oil salesman Salmond up there, along with Brown and Darling if possible.

Also worth having a read of frank's recent interviews and his disinterest in getting wrangled in politics / being labelled political / protest orientated. He's been tarred a few times and I'm guessing but I doubt he will want to again.

User avatar
Tomasz
Posts: 1546
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2005 11:05 am

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by Tomasz » Thu Oct 09, 2014 11:40 am

valkyriemp wrote:It's not about sore losers
It quite clearly is. The no campaign won every poll bar one and won the election fair and square. Conspiracy theories that it was all rigged are just embarrassing.
Pete wrote:Sometimes, I wish I was a dog on a swing.

User avatar
Danlechief
Posts: 472
Joined: Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:19 am

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by Danlechief » Thu Oct 09, 2014 11:48 am

What's a Scotland?
"Age is no object if you're in love.

Oh shit what have I just said?"

frank turner, Birmingham, 18th November 2015

Unorthadox1080
Posts: 208
Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:01 am

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by Unorthadox1080 » Thu Oct 09, 2014 5:26 pm

type any derivitive of We are the 45% into facebook and see what you find.
I can't stress enough how much I hate the 45 thing. Our priority is the 55 not the 45.

valkyriemp
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2014 11:28 pm

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by valkyriemp » Mon Nov 10, 2014 12:34 am

It's not about yes or no or 45 or 55 that's the thing. And in the very interview you referenced Frank speaks of an egalitarian idea of what should be running our country - how to create equity and fairness for all. For some of us, there's been a stinking realisation that our party politicians are desperately trying to find their way to quieten us all down with empty promises...when that was what we wanted. It's not about patriotic nationalism or indeed the SNP at all, it's about realising that the voice of the people has the right to be heard too. We learned a lot about the conflicting statements issued by politicians, depending on their audience, or indeed what the media chooses to share with you about that. Happy to let it lie now but felt compelled to set the record straight. It seems to me, dissatisfaction with our political system is not unique to Scotland. I was genuinely just interested to know how far that dissatisfaction goes.

User avatar
Tomasz
Posts: 1546
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2005 11:05 am

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by Tomasz » Mon Nov 10, 2014 2:23 pm

"It's not about patriotic nationalism or indeed the SNP at all, it's about realising that the voice of the people has the right to be heard too. "

It was. You lost.
Pete wrote:Sometimes, I wish I was a dog on a swing.

valkyriemp
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2014 11:28 pm

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by valkyriemp » Wed Nov 12, 2014 7:46 pm

The Yes campaign lost the referendum - you are absolutely right. But have I personally lost anything? Absolutely not...I wanted better for the people of our country than we have right now - that's all. And I appreciate that we perhaps already have some benefits that the rest of the UK doesn't have.

To be honest, I thought I might have lost hope at one point, and think often of Franks reference to packin up the pamphlets and being let down again by some poor excuse for protest. Now, I remind my friends often that memories of hope, and of glorious defeat, are a little bit harder to beat!

I appreciate that some people would rather not think about how easily we are manipulated by our Government and their media...not ours. Indeed might rather be a dog on a swing - and I get that, I really do! But I also know that there are many people across our united kingdom who are unhappy. For whom life is getting harder and harder whilst Europe get to charge us lots because we're so economically successful - that just doesn't tally. All I'm saying is there's lots of info out there to help you find out the facts between the headlines that are used to control us.

And thank you for your response, however negative. I like to think you at least read a little bit of my post. Took awhile for it to sink in with me too. I used to be a sunshine, lollipops and rainbows kinda gal - I still have my good days.

:P

justin time
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 8:54 pm

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by justin time » Thu Nov 13, 2014 11:43 am

Stand up and take the power back.It's time the fat cats had a heart attack.

Pete
Posts: 6621
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:10 am

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by Pete » Sat Nov 15, 2014 1:58 pm

Small point - SNP had every intention of taking Scotland into the EU and you'd likely end up spending more on this than previously as you would not benefit from the previously negotiated rebate.

I find all this 'blinded by the headlines' and 'controlled by the media' stuff quite funny. It tends to be the lines used by sixth form politics students who have found a few blogs with revelations re the 'MSM'. This isn't necessarily a criticism, I've done the very same... But to be honest, the truth tends to lie at the bottom of reems and reems of dry economic data that almost no one in the media or general public understand or care about. The whole argument for independence, from both sides, was just lowest common denominator spin, smoke and mirrors.
frank wrote:Think of it like weight-lifting. High notes are heavy weights.

Unorthadox1080
Posts: 208
Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:01 am

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by Unorthadox1080 » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:04 am

Pete wrote: I find all this 'blinded by the headlines' and 'controlled by the media' stuff quite funny. It tends to be the lines used by sixth form politics students who have found a few blogs with revelations re the 'MSM'.
Why else do you think there was such a massive gap between under 30's how mostly voted yes and over 60's who mostly voted no? Social media made a massive difference. If your only news source is a shitty bias tabloid or news channels who became functions of the British establishment then you can begin to understand why pensioners voted no.

User avatar
frank
Site Admin
Posts: 4194
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2005 6:47 pm

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by frank » Sun Nov 16, 2014 11:47 am

Unorthadox1080 wrote:
Pete wrote: I find all this 'blinded by the headlines' and 'controlled by the media' stuff quite funny. It tends to be the lines used by sixth form politics students who have found a few blogs with revelations re the 'MSM'.
Why else do you think there was such a massive gap between under 30's how mostly voted yes and over 60's who mostly voted no? Social media made a massive difference. If your only news source is a shitty bias tabloid or news channels who became functions of the British establishment then you can begin to understand why pensioners voted no.
But hold on, hold on, that's just the classic sour grapes of the Marxist left. "False consciousness" is history's most laughable excuse for losing an argument. Maybe those pensioners have more life experience, thought about it more, and decided differently? Maybe not, but to just claim that the only reason someone disagrees with you is because they've been duped (while you, of course, are impervious to external influence) is intellectually silly.
Shows? All of em.

"He's like an Uncle, I like him but I don't want to listen to him all day."

Pete
Posts: 6621
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:10 am

Re: Anybody feeling political? Scotland is!

Post by Pete » Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:33 pm

frank wrote:
Unorthadox1080 wrote:
Pete wrote: I find all this 'blinded by the headlines' and 'controlled by the media' stuff quite funny. It tends to be the lines used by sixth form politics students who have found a few blogs with revelations re the 'MSM'.
Why else do you think there was such a massive gap between under 30's how mostly voted yes and over 60's who mostly voted no? Social media made a massive difference. If your only news source is a shitty bias tabloid or news channels who became functions of the British establishment then you can begin to understand why pensioners voted no.
But hold on, hold on, that's just the classic sour grapes of the Marxist left. "False consciousness" is history's most laughable excuse for losing an argument. Maybe those pensioners have more life experience, thought about it more, and decided differently? Maybe not, but to just claim that the only reason someone disagrees with you is because they've been duped (while you, of course, are impervious to external influence) is intellectually silly.
And, whilst I appreciate the argument that social media is a great tool for engagement of the masses, to try to insinuate that this is a better source for truth than even the very worst tabloid is nonsense. One of the main reasons I left Facebook years ago was the dross I was reading during the last election. I vividly remember a doctor posting a quote of “those who vote Tories in their thirties, vote BNP in their forties” with tonnes of likes underneath despite it quite clearly being utter bollocks – a fact held up by a very quick review of the BNP’s vote share – following this logic they would have made it a lot closer to power as eighties Thatcher voters made it into their forties and beyond!

The number of good friends I saw regurgitating utter rubbish was incredibly frustrating and caused me to get into multiple debates with them. In fairness many of them were surprised to discover what they had reposted from elsewhere turned out to be completely incorrect but I imagine the vast majority out there don’t have an irritating and vaguely irate friend such as I and continue to blindly believe what they read and repost from other’s feeds to be gospel.

I’d certainly say older generations are far less easily influenced than those younger, whether you deem this as them being stubborn / set in their ways / disciples of the Daily Mail, or possibly more hardened and basing their view on a far vaster wealth of experience, making it more difficult for short term views to sway them, is a personal opinion.
frank wrote:Think of it like weight-lifting. High notes are heavy weights.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests