Where is Amy?

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frank
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by frank » Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:25 pm

without wanting to get too far into this... "amy" is not anyone's real name who has relevance to this conversation. I wouldn't do it that way. I wouldn't say that any of it is fictional as such, just that there's a couple of different situations that have ended up being amalgamated in song. I certainly have my reasons for using the same name each time, it has a continuity to it, and there are one or two people who directly understand why.
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by darlenet. » Sat Jan 19, 2013 1:21 am

thecosmickid wrote:I'd just like to comment on a few things that have been said in this thread.

First, several people are mentioned in Reasons Not to be an Idiot. Frank's friend's ex is the first one mentioned while Amy is the last one, so Amy is clearly not the friend's ex.

Just before (or just after) England Keep my Bones was released Frank stated, in some interview, that I am Disappeared is fictional. This makes me think that Amy herself is fictional, or perhaps at most inspired by a real person.

Finally, I think you should be able to discuss an artist's personal life. As long as it is relevant to his/her art. For example, do you think it's unethical when scholars analyse every single piece of a poets very personal love letter or his/her diary? Knowing where something came from greatly enhances your understanding of it. So, if you're trying to understand a song you should definitely discuss the writer's personal life because it's a great tool for understanding. If you're doing it purely to satisfy your need for gossip, then it's of course not OK. But we're all fans trying to understand songs we love and that's a good thing! :)
I am sorry, but I respectfully disagree with this premise. I appreciate art, literature and music as it is presented by the artist. I do not have the need to "analyze" it or "understand" it. It just is. When I listen to Frank's music, the lyrics often evoke emotions in me from my own experiences. I really don't need to know the exact details of the genesis of the song. I actually think too much analysis can make the art, song, music too.....I guess ordinary would be the word.

So, I feel that what the artists present, is the product we are meant to see. Sometimes what is omitted is as significant as what is there. But to each his own. Everyone enoys the arts in their own way.

Peace,

Darlene
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by dutton316 » Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:22 am

darlenet. wrote:I am sorry, but I respectfully disagree with this premise. I appreciate art, literature and music as it is presented by the artist. I do not have the need to "analyze" it or "understand" it. It just is. When I listen to Frank's music, the lyrics often evoke emotions in me from my own experiences. I really don't need to know the exact details of the genesis of the song. I actually think too much analysis can make the art, song, music too.....I guess ordinary would be the word.

So, I feel that what the artists present, is the product we are meant to see. Sometimes what is omitted is as significant as what is there. But to each his own. Everyone enoys the arts in their own way.

Peace,

Darlene
Agree with this generally. Music, poetry, etc. is what you make of it, and what it means to you.

However I'd argue that some facts are relevant, say Syvia Plath's life, or Tolstoy's religious conversion when reading The Death of Ivan Ilyich.

Just a general point, not pushing for anything.
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by KangarooAlice » Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:12 pm

Weirdly, I wrote about this a few days ago. I know it's slightly ironic putting it on here, seeing as it's an Internet forum, but ah well! http://town-called-alice.blogspot.co.uk ... c.html?m=1
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by darlenet. » Sun Jan 20, 2013 2:21 pm

KangarooAlice wrote:Weirdly, I wrote about this a few days ago. I know it's slightly ironic putting it on here, seeing as it's an Internet forum, but ah well! http://town-called-alice.blogspot.co.uk ... c.html?m=1
Lovely blog. I have thought those exact things! It is a fine line for sure to utilize social media, but to not become creepy.

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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by darlenet. » Sun Jan 20, 2013 2:34 pm

dutton316 wrote:However I'd argue that some facts are relevant, say Syvia Plath's life, or Tolstoy's religious conversion when reading The Death of Ivan Ilyich.
Yes, you are absolutely correct of course.

My observation was more to the point of just trying to enjoy the product as presented without so much dissection. But I think by nature of social media (here we are for example), it is inevitable. One of the joys of my youth, was anticipating an artist's record album to be released, getting it, and playing it with friends until we wore it out. We had no idea ahead of time what to expect, so it was hugely exciting to discover it together.

No argument here, it's great that everyone enjoys things their own way, and there is so much great stuff out there to enjoy.

Cheers, darlene
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by KangarooAlice » Sun Jan 20, 2013 5:51 pm

darlenet. wrote:
KangarooAlice wrote:Weirdly, I wrote about this a few days ago. I know it's slightly ironic putting it on here, seeing as it's an Internet forum, but ah well! http://town-called-alice.blogspot.co.uk ... c.html?m=1
Lovely blog. I have thought those exact things! It is a fine line for sure to utilize social media, but to not become creepy.

darlene
Thanks :) It really is. It's like..the Internet is an amazing place, but also quite terrifying at the same time! I find how people behave to things like that really interesting, almost as much as music itself!
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by TheOneWorthLeaving » Fri May 10, 2013 9:36 pm

On my first listen, I thought that the Amy described in Tell -Tale Signs sounded like a textbook (possibly undiagnosed) Bordeline Personality Disorder case, and I think that even more every time I listen. And the love for her (that turned into a claim upon Frank's soul) also sounds like a classic co-dependency kind of 'claim' that girls with BPD often have over their partners.

But maybe I'm just reading into it too much, and relating it to a past experience of mine. Yep probably that haha...

Great song anyway, very touching.

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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by seamiedev » Sun May 12, 2013 3:33 pm

SanDimas1988 wrote:On the Wembley dvd, before Reasons Not to Be An Idiot he stated the song is about his friend's ex-girlfriend. He's also using this as an intro before he plays it at US shows on this tour,
Last night he said it was HIS ex, or did I mis-hear him :?:
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by Helium » Mon May 13, 2013 4:58 pm

seamiedev wrote:
Last night he said it was HIS ex, or did I mis-hear him :?:
He said that in Leeds too.
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by Emsabobs » Mon May 13, 2013 7:15 pm

And all the ones I was at last week too....
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by minidazzler » Tue May 14, 2013 8:55 am

seamiedev wrote:
SanDimas1988 wrote:On the Wembley dvd, before Reasons Not to Be An Idiot he stated the song is about his friend's ex-girlfriend. He's also using this as an intro before he plays it at US shows on this tour,
Last night he said it was HIS ex, or did I mis-hear him :?:
I think Amy/Amie is an amalgamated character. The Amy from Reasons is definitely not the same Amy as from Tell Tale Signs.

Though I do think the Amy from Tell Tale Signs and I Am Disappeared are the same ones.

Amy is just a name he uses for exes so that he's not naming names. It's kinda like The Gaslight Anthem using Maria for girls they shag and Virginia for girls they love.

Let's be fair, if he named names he'd never be able to step foot in London again, the girls he'd name would kill him for that and those he doesn't would kill him because they'd feel left out.
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by smige2 » Tue May 14, 2013 10:53 am

minidazzler wrote:Amy is just a name he uses for exes so that he's not naming names. It's kinda like The Gaslight Anthem using Maria for girls they shag and Virginia for girls they love.
I think that's probably it. Didn't realise the Gaslight thing, though.
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Re: Where is Amy?

Post by pervertedcoffee » Sat May 18, 2013 2:43 pm

frank wrote: "amy" is not anyone's real name who has relevance to this conversation.
So, as irrelevant as I apparently am to the conversation, I'm going to doff my literary nerd cap anyway. :P

I'm really loving the New Critical Theory/Formalist Critical Theory vs. Biographical Critical Theory vibe going on in this discussion (and a tiny bit of Reader Reaction Crit Theory and all!) Formalists: everything you need to think about the 'text' is in the 'text'. Bio Crits: the 'text' cannot have been created without context. Therefore context shapes the 'text' as much as the writer's talent and cannot be ignored.

It's a question that's plagued me when studying literature because I am the kind of person who likes to crawl into people's brains when I find something that resonates with me but then I also love the idea that a piece of work becomes completely independent of it's creator and takes on a whole life and context of it's own, particularly in the reader's mind. The interesting overlap, from a lit crit point of view) is that, through the reader's interpretation of the artist's life, this once again becomes part of the work and cannot be separated.

So, while a few weeks back, I bought Larkin's 'Letters to Monica' and am obsessing about cross referencing poems, couplets and letters I feel uneasy about the idea of delving into Frank's mind to the same extent. Maybe it's because Larkin is dead and I can only ever speculate. Frank on the other hand could, conceivably, be badgered, tricked, harassed, etc. into giving us the truth.

I'm in constant debate with myself weather this open access to an artist's life is a good thing or not... :s

I'm going to take off my lit nerd cap now and congratulate myself for not furthering the conversation whatsoever! Which is pretty much what happens in the lit world! :P

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